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 Open Discussion - Activity Checks, ICC/Board canon
Storm
 Posted: Feb 3 2015, 03:13 PM
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too many ninjas, 0/10
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alright so! as you might have noticed, we haven't had a proper activity check in a while, due to november and december being months where everyone is typically busy. we've still had pretty good board activity throughout, which is really great! but after some discussion, meeks and I decided to ask the community at large how you guys would like to proceed

the thing is, we want to continue keeping up board activity, and encourage it, but we also don't want staying active or passing a check to become stressful. this is a hobby after all! our goal is to keep am flexible and fun to engage in, so, first of all

should any changes be made to the activity checks? (required amount of posts lower, extended time, whatever)

what would you guys like to see on the board, or might help engage you?

meeks and I do have some plot stuff in the works, but that's still under wraps and might not be ready to go for a while yet. we're always open to hear your suggestions and opinions aaaand I thought that now was a good time to check in with everyone!

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Epsilon
 Posted: Feb 3 2015, 03:49 PM
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BELIEVE IT.
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    Personally, I think we've got a good activity check system in place, so long as it's well-maintained and such. In general, that's kind of my only concern, that things remain efficient and well-maintained. I'm not saying the site is sloppy or anything, but the claims and dropped characters seem to take a while to get updated, and the 'who plays who'/'taken characters' threads are a bit out of date in some areas.

    On another note, I've personally found it difficult to get characters on the board quickly. The reason, I think, is because it's tough to get new characters into threads without filling up the board with open threads-- people are active, and a lot of people don't want to start up new threads without having finished up old ones. I'd like to see some kind of solution to this, because it's just been a little tough having to scrounge around for new threads in order to get a character accepted. My suggestion is that the rule where the latest character needs a post in order to get a new character accepted be done away with. Personally, I think overall activity is more important than specific activity with newer characters.

    A sense of continuity is also a little difficult for me to grasp. For the most part, I've been assuming (for my characters) board canon = ICC canon, but most other people don't really seem to be assuming as much. It's a little awkward for me, and maybe just a little awkward in general, because most plotting and character relationships go on in the ICC. I'd suggest making either a concrete boundary between the ICC's canon and the board's canon, or just combining the two for good. (EDIT: I'd personally prefer the latter, of course, and the former would separate the two canons so distinctly that it would feel like they aren't even really the same site, in my opinion at least.)

    That's basically it for me! Thanks for hearing me out and such.

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Jemi
 Posted: Feb 3 2015, 03:51 PM
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Daemon AU Queen Of Skeleton Hell
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WELL personally i didn't have too many problems with how it used to be! three posts a month with any character shouldn't be too hard for most people to manage, i think, and maybe there could be even more lenient things during Busy Times like exam months and around holidays and such when people are busy, ooooor if like..............a bunch of drama has happened and people are kind of freaked out, like what happened around september which HOPEFULLY won't occur again.

however! one of the problems i did have with the previous activity checks was the fact that, if they didn't have the correct number of posts, people couldn't save their characters? which, i guess, could result in problems, such as people continually just swooping in to save their characters at the last minute, buuuut idk it still felt like too much of a pressure of people??? maybe people who continually do that kind of thing can be dealt with on a case by case basis? idk it was always just something that Bothered me, that posts made during the activity check didn't really count towards that month's activity.

BUT that's just my opinion! i thought i'd bring it to the table for discussion, just in case some people might feel the same way.

as far as board activity goes, i'm not too discontented or not engaged with what's going on now?? some new areas might be cool, buuuut apart from that, i'm good!

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Storm
 Posted: Feb 3 2015, 09:01 PM
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too many ninjas, 0/10
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oKAY I am going to hold off on addressing everything because a) I kind of have a fever and I doubt that would be a good idea to attempt it and b ) meeks should have a chance to post before I hog the entire thread

but it's true that I've been dropping the ball on the list management portion of the site, aaaand that's my fault! I've been distracted recently or tired out from work but it's honestly not that difficult to keep it all going so I'll really try and stay on top of it

we'll totally consider taking another look at the "one post with your newest character" rule as well as possibly making checks more lenient in terms of being able to keep your characters!

and uh I do want to bring up icc and board canon since that's been a mess since... before I joined but maybe let's handle activity stuff first and then decide how to handle that? that being said I have some characters whose arcs were vastly different board-wise and while that's... really inconvenient, merging with icc canon would be really tough wHICH is of course a thing we should all also discuss!

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Meeks
 Posted: Feb 4 2015, 03:37 AM
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TuskFan211
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WELL FIRST OFF all things considered I think doing away with the "one post has to be with your newest character to get an app accepted" thing would work, and help with the excess of open threads. That's fine with me, as long as people don't like...start apping characters and then forgetting to ever post with them, which is why we had that rule in the first place I think, but a lot has changed since then. sO. That's something I'm for as long as we keep an eye on it.

As for the ICC vs. Board Canon issue I'm a liiiiittle bit torn on that. The ICC moves faster, obviously, and so development happens faster too. When too big a gap between board and ICC canon is created then it DOES get awkward or hard to keep up with. But the thing is, I've always felt that for me -- when I blend the two together too much, I end up favoring the ICC heavily and almost NEVER have threads with major events/character development happening. I actually see few of those occurring on the board, in general, and I think sometimes our boards are reduced to like....Wacky Antics Threads or Random Meetings or one time discussions that arent followed up on and such (which are all fun, but it becomes evident when all the Major Stuff is happening in the ICC). Maybe we can discuss how to find a compromise here?? Maybe the Plot Stuff Storm and I have been planning will help, idk.

aLSO I WAS UNDER THE IMPRESSION THAT the rule where people can't save their characters during an activity check was outdated?? maybe i'm on a different page than everyone else but we haven't been enforcing that for a while, or at least i haven't. but if i'm totally wrong and that's still in effect, we can talk about that too!

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Epsilon
 Posted: Feb 5 2015, 11:20 AM
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BELIEVE IT.
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    Yeah, I think most of the specific people the rule was created for, or... the specific person (who has been gone for about a year now), are completely gone. At this point, I'm fairly certain the memberbase can be trusted to be active with all of their characters, but it's ultimately the admins' call. In general right now, activity has been in kind of a slump, so it would be great if any bit of activity could be used towards the purpose of getting a new character on the board. I guess, since I tend to have large rosters and do have a large roster planned atm, I'd really appreciate it if I could get that roster onto the board quickly as possible so I can focus on each character's individual arc.

    On the ICC/board canon note, I think creating a cohesive site, especially one where the ICC is so prevalent, has to combine both canons into one. Otherwise, at least in my opinion, it feels like two totally different sites. The contradictory canons is really weird for me, when I want to develop my characters quickly and involve ICC development in threads. Personally, I'm of the opinion that the ICC and board canon merging would be excellent for the purpose of starting up more meaningful and interesting threads. Save for a few (the Sasuke/Itachi thread comes to mind), the most meaningful and interesting threads I've had on the site were from when ICC canon was transported to board canon.

    What I'm saying, basically, is that once development of characters is allowed to move quickly in an ICC setting, more cohesive and interesting relationships and situations can be put onto the board. It might be difficult for some people to pull everything from ICC canon onto the boards, particularly since arcs and relationships have differed so wildly, but I honestly do think it would be worth it in both establishing a more cohesive setting and making interesting threads.

    As for the no posts during the activity check rule, I was also under the impression that the rule had been done away with. If it isn't, though, it would be nice to see it gotten rid of. I mean, much like the first potential rule change, the members who have been causing problems on that note are gone, so more leniency seems reasonable. Like I said, though, I was under the impression that it was already gotten rid of.

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Storm
 Posted: Feb 5 2015, 11:37 AM
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too many ninjas, 0/10
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oh my god I didn't notice how ninja-themed your account was until now

regarding the posting and saving characters with the activity check, I think the problem here is that it's... no longer been much of a thing but I don't think we ever explicitly announced that rule changing? sO we should do that! eps is right tho, a lot of the rules are holdovers from dealing with specific members and they should be rehauled or removed

I'm tentatively in favour of merging icc and board canon, but that would require some heavy soulsearching on my end about how some characters have been doing on the board (mostly sasook) and how to work with fusing them together when they're... wildly different by this point

that doesn't mean I'm not for it though since I've gotten more used to a single board canon from bad end but meeks' point about favouring the icc is valid - it can take a while to figure out what sort of events fit the board more vs being played out in the icc and striking that balance can be difficult! so uh I'd def like to hear from everyone else on this

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Epsilon
 Posted: Feb 5 2015, 12:22 PM
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BELIEVE IT.
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    DEAR SASUKE I HAD TO LIE BUT PLEASE DONT ABUSE YOUR ENCHANTED EYES

    ... Eddie Rath aside, Meeks does have a good point about the ICC being favored and the board potentially being ignored as a result. However, I've always found that speculation on that kind of thing is only speculation until its been tested... buuut, this is a problem that would be difficult to test. Board and ICC canon can't be merged and then unmerged, it would have to be a permanent change to prevent awkward rehauling. It makes it a pretty big challenge, but I'm fairly competent that the memberbase here can be trusted to make full use of the board. I, for one, really love posting and ICCing, and my primary reasoning for wanting to combine the two canons is so I can write the characters I've developed in the ICC on the board.

    ...

    Also, I'm kinda sorry for turning the topic of this thread entirely over to ICC and board canon, it's just been on my mind for a bit and I wanted to bring it up.

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Jemi
 Posted: Feb 5 2015, 12:30 PM
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Daemon AU Queen Of Skeleton Hell
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ON THE SUBJECT OF BOARD CANON VS ICC CANON

i've always been kind of selective myself about what i transfer over from icc canon onto board canon. for example: vivi will be working for cordy in her threads hereon out because they've met and interacted in the icc, an event that would have really only been a tedious "first-meeting" sort of thing onboard, but in board canon, she hasn't met lewis yet and has no idea he even exists in this world, even though they've met in the icc. personally, i find most first meeting-type situations are carried over well from the icc canon, buuuuut i'm not sure about like....super big events???

personally, i think it should be up for everyone with characters involved in a certain situation whether or not something should translate over from icc canon to board canon. like, for example, eps asking meeks if dandy's vampirism could be translated over. it puts everyone on the same general page with as few complications as possible.

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Meeks
 Posted: Feb 6 2015, 06:53 AM
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TuskFan211
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YEAH SEE I FEEL THIS JEMI.

it's just....not always possible to just transfer over everything to board canon. remember that we have a claiming period of one month. and then you get an additional month to ICC the character if you put up an app for them. that's two potential months of a character existing in the ICC and not on the board, and then if that character ends up never getting apped (which sometimes happens, people realize they don't want to play a character longterm and that's fine) then it just gets awkward transferring that to board canon when these people never actually existed on the board.

((extra note: i realize that on the flip side, this also means that people who have ICCed a character for two months and then DO end up apping them may not just want to start all over again in board canon, and that's fine i don't have a problem with that - i'm specifically talking about cases where the character just doesn't work out))

WHICH IS WHY I THINK whatever we do about this, we should keep the rule of "for something to be translated to board canon, all involved characters must also exist on the board." so if you get that character apped after two months, you can bring their board canon right up to date assuming that other people have also apped their characters, but people don't end up in an awkward situation if the character doesn't get apped.

i'm not opposed to like...blending the canons somewhat if that's what people want to do, but i also think space should be left for situations where that isn't possible/people really just want to do their own thing. like as it is now, as eps mentioned, the general mindset is "the canons are seperate unless people explicitly state otherwise". well maybe we could alter things to make it "the canons are the same unless people explicitly state otherwise."

i just personally want the option not to transfer stuff over to the board if i don't really think it'll work or if i want to do things differently. like storm, i one character at least (morgana) who is still in a waaay different place in board canon than she is in ICC canon. i also have a few characters who have some significantly different ICC vs. board histories (one example i can think of is the katherine and oswin dalek thing and how that came about in the different canons - in the ICC, oswin told her and they had a very poignant conversation about it and development stemming from that, but in board canon it happened in a much different way and one of my favorite threads and i'd...really rather not have to erase either of those).

so yeah those are some more of my thoughts.

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Fate
 Posted: Feb 10 2015, 11:47 PM
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A Real Live Dragon
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Hey! Most of the stuff's been covered already and I share a lot of opinions already stated because it took me forever to reply to this bUT I just wanna throw my input into this, still.

So, on the matter of Board vs ICC, I'm in the same boat as Jemi and Meeks where there are certain things in board canon that are different in ICC canon and those are things that I like and want to keep. I really liked Meeks' idea of them sharing canon unless stated otherwise. Then, that's already a default for new characters who are just getting started on the board but already have ICC canon development. It would also probably prove to be easier to keep track of if we say "okay everything's the same except for this, this, and this" instead of "all of this is different but this, this, and this, are the same".

As for activity checks, I never saw an update about the leniency in rules and I've just assumed it's been the same this whole time. And tbh I never really enjoyed the part where posts didn't count on certain days. I know it was implemented because of Problem Members on the board, but it's still been a small source of anxiety for me, personally. Because for a while I also wasn't away that it was from AC to AC, not from month to month, so with the AC being in the middle of each month for a while I thought there were only twelve days for posts to count towards the AC. Of course, I know better now. Maybe with the announcement of the leniency towards ACs during its period of days, the staff could also clarify for new members (or members like me rip) that though an AC occurs monthly, the activity required for the check is the period of days between each AC, and not month to month.

AS FOR ENGAGING IDEAS FOR THE BOARD i got nothing rip in peace

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Meeks
 Posted: Feb 11 2015, 05:42 PM
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TuskFan211
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OKAY we seem to have tentative ideas about the respective canons and activity requirements, so that's good.

One more thing: Eps presented an idea to me in private aaand I thought I might kind of. Hash it out here. Just to list the benefits and disadvantages so everyone can better discuss it - because this isn't something I'd wanna do without everybody's approval.

Eps proposed another site move, to a new forum, and at first I wasn't really sure whether it'd be worth the work?? But I've thought it over some, and I'll list the pros/good reasons for it I came up with here.
  • Currently, the staff team has no access to the main admin account. Lexi still has it, and refused to give up the password before she left. A new forum with a new central admin account which the whole staff team could have access to would ensure we don't have any problems with that in the future.
  • Switching to an entirely new forum might be the freshest and easiest way to...reboot the site, in general?? Get a new skin, rehash the rules (which we've needed to do for awhile), update all the lists, sift through and get rid of old threads. It would be a mass clean-up in a way that might be more motivational than just having to spruce up this place.
  • On an individual basis, it would also be a good opportunity for people to refresh their rosters and decide which characters to keep. I know some of us have been having muse and/or motivation issues lately and I think doing this as we're moving would eliminate a lot of the guilt and hesitation that usually surrounds it??
  • Eps also pointed out that we've been looking for a way to get people more enthusiastic about posting and it could help with that, too!
  • We currently have an active member group of....maaaybe six or seven or eight people?? Moving sites would also help to "clean out" the inactive members who we've kind of been...uncertainly waiting on and give us a better idea of which people and characters are still around, aND it might be helpful with advertising! I think people feel more encouraged to join a newer, fresher board than one thats been around for a few years and is currently a bit slow with activity.

I'm thinking if people were on board for this, such a move could take place after Storm and I work out some plot stuff and implement the next phase of that?? Maybe we could be quietly working on the other forum, in the mean time, so it's all ready to go for the Official Move. People's applications, active threads, and any OOC threads you'd like to keep could all be ported over, and even things like post counts (which I know some people take pride in/have fun accumulating) could be transferred at member request.

We could also address any other concerns/requests for a board change that people would like to see and accommodate you guys (though sTORM i'd like to here from you specifically on this since...you are my fellow staff member and i don't want to speak for both of us and def won't be doing this without your approval).

aND that's the extent that I've really thought on it so far. again i'd love to hear on everyone on this about whether this is even a thing people would be interested in??? or if you guys really just want to stay here.

so yeah.


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when the last light warms the rocks and the rattlesnakes unfold
mountain cats will come to drag away your bones
but rise with me forever across the silent sand
and the stars will be your eyes, and the wind will be my hands

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Storm
 Posted: Feb 11 2015, 05:48 PM
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too many ninjas, 0/10
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hMMM I admit that came out of left field but

those are very good reasons! it's true that I'm very uneasy about the situation surrounding the main admin account and this would ensure we have absolute control over all our own stuff without fear of

anything petty or some kind of sudden retribution

and everything else works out, imo? like... it's true that it's just easier to get excited about a new, fresh slate rather than polishing up one that's been around for a while (this metaphor is going nowhere, forgive me)

so yeah, if we sort of set this up in the background while meeks and I also set up the new phase of the plot, I think this would actually be a really good direction to go in! but of course even if both the staff agree, all your opinions matter to us so please get back to us on if you're cool with this! and yeah if there are things you want implemented if we do go through with this, now's a good time to speak up!

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Jemi
 Posted: Feb 16 2015, 12:56 AM
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Daemon AU Queen Of Skeleton Hell
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YO I definitely agree that a site move would be a good thing!! i think with everything that's happened, we could all use something of a fresh start, and moving to a new site would ensure we'd be Safe and............not under the risk of having everything yanked out from under us due to Things.

so yeah, i generally agree with everyone else that's posted their opinions on this!

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